Nov. 17, 2020

03 - Using Data to explain your Recovery - Justin Roethlingshoefer

03 - Using Data to explain your Recovery - Justin Roethlingshoefer

Using Data to explain your Recovery


Justin Roethlingshoefer is the founder of the Hockey Summit and all inclusive training camp for professional hockey players. And this camp utilizes the same techniques from his book Intent. His born and raised in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada, and now resides in New York City. Justin is a coach and author, a speaker, and I would add a little bit of a data nerd to the mix and he will attest to that. Justin is all about recovery for max performance and takes a unique stance on monitoring recovery. We chat about recovery data points, what you should start tracking and what you should stop tracking, as well as the five stages of burnout and much more.



Justin Roethlingshoefer:




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Jase Kraft: [00:00:00] Welcome to the Sports Recovery podcast, we have a great guest on the show today with a bachelor's degree in movement science and master's degree in exercise physiology Justin Roethlingshoefer is the founder of the Hockey Summit and all inclusive training camp for professional hockey players. And this camp utilizes the same techniques from his book Intent. His born and raised in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada, and now resides in New York City. Justin is a coach and author, a speaker, and I would add a little bit of a data nerd to the mix and he will attest to that. Justin is all about recovery for max performance and takes a unique stance on monitoring recovery. We chat about recovery data points, what you should start tracking and what you should stop tracking, as well as the five stages of burnout and much more.


Jase Kraft: [00:01:02] No further ado. Let's get into.


Jase Kraft: [00:01:08] You're listening to the Science of Sports Recovery podcast. Each week, we explore how to recover more efficiently from training so you can work out harder and realize your full potential. This is the Science of Sports Recovery podcast.


Jase Kraft: [00:01:36] Hey, Justin, great to have you on the podcast.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:01:39] It's awesome to be here, just thank you so much for having me on. It's awesome to be involved with people pushing the performance sector forward. And you're doing an awesome job. So thanks so much for having me.


Jase Kraft: [00:01:50] Yeah, no problem.


Jase Kraft: [00:01:51] So that we got a little bit of background on you on the intro, but that's more of the what you do. I like to kind of get in the mind of why you came into this space. So what about recovery and kind of the data behind it or even before we go there? I mean, what about strength and conditioning led you to where you are now?


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:02:15] Yeah, for sure. So it it all started in my playing career. It was never the biggest guy, was never the strongest guy. It's never the fastest, most talented. But what allowed me to play at the level that I did and and get as far as I did and in college and my first pro contract and everything else in hockey was simply that I helped people and was able to be coached from the age of about 16 by some very great performance coaches. And they helped me fall in love with the strength and conditioning side of things. And in the science that went into it and just figuring out how I could pull out every last ounce of potential that I had, even though I wasn't, again, the most God gifted, talented player out there.


Jase Kraft: [00:03:06] Yeah. Cool,so you're in the pros and then obviously now you're doing more of the coaching, the how how long was your career in and the pros and what led you to the coaching side of it.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:03:17] I was just a cup of coffee and in the pros I went from my senior year signed year contract and from there we went right into the coaching space. I had an affinity for raising my sophomore year of college. I just knew that this was a space I wanted to be on my way up through the ranks to. I had a lot of high quality, great coaches that helped inspire me to want to help give back to other players. And so that's kind of where I led. And I always use myself as a guinea pig. Rachmat has guys always thought I was weird for hooking up myself to heart rate monitor. And when I was sleeping there, then when I was on the ice to hold my stuff, to put them on the GPS tracker to my fingers, look at lactate levels and all of this stuff, you know what? I can pull out every last potential myself. And as I started to do that, obviously guys like you, they try to me as we seem to do things differently, going to again, I feel so much better than I ever have in my life. And so even as a player going through my last year, my junior year of college in the NCAA, I was kind of acting as a player coach anyways. Yeah, with the with the experiments I was doing and kind of seeing where we could test the waters and kind of get that last little bit of performance.


Jase Kraft: [00:04:48] So. So what what was the weirdest thing you did for recovery that everybody was like, man, that's never going to work.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:04:58] I mean, it's not that they said it would never work.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:05:01] And the weirdest thing was I would actually like pee in the cup and take a look at the ketone, issue of hydration and, and everything was really going from the ice to the weight room and to help identify how much I needed to get back in. And one of the other issues were these two things. I was just I was just fascinated by it. I was absolutely, at the other thing. It was weird, is it? Guys always thought I was I would sleep with heart rate monitor and my roommate was just like, what are you doing, had roommate on the baseball team, Another one,


Jase Kraft: [00:05:40] Yeah,


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:05:42] hockey, and they just they just could not wrap your head around it. But as in a place where I am today, I guess that's all is I always knew you were weird man. Has it paid off and.


Jase Kraft: [00:05:54] Yeah,


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:05:55] Yeah I will do the same again because I'm a nerd that way. Said at the beginning, I love numbers, I love data, I love figuring out ways in which we can optimize the human experience. Yeah. From both the way you perform covers and ultimately show up mentally on a day in and day out.


Jase Kraft: [00:06:13] Yeah I can attest to the heart rate monitor. You get some weird looks.


Jase Kraft: [00:06:19] I wear a heart monitor when I run and you know, in the hot summer you're running without a shirt on and it's strapped right around a chest wear, a bra would go in.


Jase Kraft: [00:06:32] You get people yelling at you through the windows just random things, but. 


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:06:38] One year or so on that point is in the Florida summers. It's obviously the heat melting down on you.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:06:47] And we we were trying to the train station for hours upon hours, and this was coming back on you as this would have been two thousand, thirteen, fourteen. And so you have a tenma.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:07:03] And that tenma I goes across your back from the strap.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:07:08] And so I went back to the team and we were doing weighings first day of training camp. And I take my shirt off and I'm walking away from something.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:07:19] What did you do on Summer?


Jase Kraft: [00:07:26] Yeah,


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:07:26] It was just kind of a running joke in there. Jerry Bra, where there a brasier on this stuff.


Jase Kraft: [00:07:34] So, yeah,


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:07:38] That that's that was the pitfalls of science advancement, I guess.


Jase Kraft: [00:07:44] Yeah. Yeah. You're on experiment at the cost of your own reputation or whatever. 


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:07:52] Be the butt about the jokes.


Jase Kraft: [00:07:55] Yeah. The butt of jokes. One of my teammates in college, Nick Lawson, if he's listening, shout out to him. But we had a contest one summer who could get the best heart rate monitor tan line. So. 


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:08:09] Who won that one?


Jase Kraft: [00:08:10] He did because he he was dedicated enough to go to the beach and while he was just lounging around here and where his heart rate monitor so he could beat me. 


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:08:25] Cheated a little bit.


Jase Kraft: [00:08:26] Yeah. So but anyways, we're here to talk more about tan lines, so let's get into the you know, obviously you're a data nerd when it comes to recovery.


Jase Kraft: [00:08:41] So over the years, what have you been like tracking and what are some things that you've tracked before that are useful again to what are kind of your main staples now?


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:08:54] Yeah, absolutely. It's a great question.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:08:56] So there's so much data about everything from GPS to heart rate to blood pressure, to HRB, to respiration rate.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:09:06] You can go down a rabbit hole very big and between twenty 16, twenty eighteen. I went down there to the point where I was counting the coalition, the number of explosions, a game of hockey.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:09:21] The players were taking out the number of stops and starts to change directions to the average speed first before I started actually pouring over into the real world with entrepreneurs and executives. However, what you start to find is this is that you get older and dated with that. And if you look at a survey like anything, we can skew it. You can tell a story. We can tell a story with the data so that it to the point that you're looking for, it proves the point the way that you wanted to go. And that's so different because we you have so many data points that are maybe slightly correlated with our factory worker correlation coefficient.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:10:07] It doesn't matter to a certain extent if you have fifty pieces of data that you're looking at because the math turns very convoluted very quickly. And for a regular Joe or even a pro athlete, I will ask you to I'm willing to say that you cannot create perfection. You can't. Life is unpredictable. Sport is unpredictable, for that matter. Everything is unpredictable except for how you're showing up every single day. And so we had to narrow it down to some of the best ones. What I started to find really quickly was when you're going out to a place or you're going to play a hockey game or you're going into a meeting with your biggest investors, you're not going in saying, oh, I'm going to pull back a little bit so that I can be better for tomorrow or I'm going to go in and give it ninety three percent of my back to know you're going in and you're going to win.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:11:03] If you're a high performing individual, if you want to show up and you're successful and no matter what it is you're doing, you're going to win every single day. You're not going for a tie. You are going to play for the loss, you're going to win. And so that is where all bars should be left alone. Go in and do what you do and where the focus should actually be placed is in the recovery of the athlete, the recovery of the individual, the recovery of the person. And that's how you can optimize performance. It's not about being in the moment in your race. You had no. Go, go play. We've had twenty three other hours in the day or five other days in the week that we were able to prepare you for the moment that you're going in for. And that's the mentality change that I've had to get. A lot of my athletes out of my corporate clients heads around is it's not just showing up the day of the game and going and playing or you hear the old a lo of people used to talk about cartload going to cartload the night before I go run a big race. Well, that's the best way to actually have your worst performance the night before. And in all of these things that we traditionally thought we could just do the night before or the day of, and we'd be good to go or monitor ourselves in inrun or in the event it's a whole lead up to it. And how are we optimizing ourselves and what our objectives are looking at? So it really became not so much about the actual event itself, but the recovery aspect. And that is where you can make the biggest gains in the performance industry.


Jase Kraft: [00:12:42] Yeah, you bring up a good point of last data during the actual performance is better.


Jase Kraft: [00:12:50] I know from my experience, my best races, I don't wear a watch. I wasn't looking at the time.


Jase Kraft: [00:12:57] I was all about what my body was doing, how I perceived what it was doing and where the competitors were, you know, and eventually I just like stopped what my body was doing. Just ran for the competition. Yeah. And I and I see this and, you know, basketball players, I would imagine the hockey players or maybe the first quarter period they're going they had a lot of running to do and then they're like, oh, I'm spent, you know, but they're not focused on the now instead of the past is like, what more can you give right now in your sport, in your boardroom? You're meeting your employees rather than thinking about what's coming and what's behind you?


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:13:47]  If you know being present and knowing how you can drive forward and you bring up a good point.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:13:52] One of my a couple of my players would always say this is Justin where am I today, where am I today? And used to say just go play. They forget about where you just go play.


Jase Kraft: [00:14:05] Yeah,


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:14:05] Because guess what? Our head coach is going to be looking at us and with ten minutes left of the game done by one, do you think he's going to be keeping best players off the ice?


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:14:14] Not a chance, do you think coming into this season of if you're an executive and you're presenting and it's the biggest presentation that you have, but you have to get it done that you're not going to push a little bit harder to cross that line and to get it done well?


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:14:30] Well, of course you are. It's a no brainer. Why are we going to limit you or hold you back? If I want you to empty the tank, I want you to go over the level that you think you're going to go, because guess what? The moment that you've completed, I am going to work with you. I'm going to teach you how to recover super maxillary so that you can come back even better than what you just did. You are surpassing barriers and that's performance. It's going completely backwards. We focus so much on the performance. So the physical work that's being done in the weight room, in the on the field of performance, I hear this all the time from the executive point. Where should I get my heart rate when I'm going through my runs? Where should I get my heart rate when I'm doing my boot camp classes?


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:15:22] Where should I get my heart rate when I'm in my spin class on my telephone and it's like work to a maximum effort to find one number and that one number is strain, I want to know if that's all I want to know is where is your strain number at? We're completed where we at and then from there that that helps us figure out what we're going to do for the rest of the day. Yeah. How much are we going to recover?


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:15:46] How much sleep are we going to get? What is our routine like? What is our nighttime routine with our sleep hygiene look like? What are we doing from a supplementation standpoint? What are we doing from the morning routine standpoint?


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:15:57] What do we doing from a nutritional standpoint? We increasing calories. We decreasing calories at that point for a lot of people don't matter either. It just becomes a matter of habit in terms of portion sizes and making sure we're getting the proper amount of portions of it. It becomes so simple that it's one step after the next, after the next, and it literally becomes iterative and we start to learn the processes in which maximize performance.


Jase Kraft: [00:16:23] Yeah. So you talked, you know, the one big metric is strain And I would imagine there's different metrics that you track on the recovery side like how much sleep and quality and that kind of stuff, but what goes into the strain metric?


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:16:44] Yeah, that's great. Great, great question.


Justin Roethlingshoefer: [00:16:46] So strain is a metric and survived by heart rate of heart rate and the time timestep. And once we're able to understand the time, total time spent in certain heart rates with certain movement because we're tracking all the twenty four...